As it gets nearer to the appeal hearing brought by two members of BackTo60 on July 21 to recover their lost pensions from 60 to 66 I gave another interview tonight to Ian Rothwell, presenter for Salford City Radio, which has been covering the issue of the women’s lost pensions.
I make no apologies for raising again the extraordinary findings that the Department for Work and Pensions has admitted that 4.6 million men were able to get auto credits from the age of 60 for 35 years from 1983 to 2018.
The disclosure is all the more damaging because a central theme of the DWP at the court hearing was that the raising of the pension age from 60 to now 66 was an issue of equality to end discrimination against men – without disclosing the scale of auto credits given to men to cover their national insurance contributions.
Even now while many women born in the 1950s are suffering severe hardship by waiting for their pension, men have the opportunity, thanks to ex pensions minister, Steve Webb, raising the issue ,to claim back the money they lost if they had paid national insurance contributions while they were over 60 during this period.
The DWP may be able to claim that for some men they already had enough contributions so it was immaterial, or that some died or moved abroad before they could claim their pension, that misses the main point.
The main point is that there was much more of a level playing field between men and women than the DWP acknowledged at the hearing. Men needn’t have paid NI insurance even if they took a low paid job. And if they had an occupational pension and their wife had retired they needn’t have bothered to contribute any further to their state pension or even worked.
Anyway you can hear the interview at the top of the blog.
Westminster Confidential 
Thank you, David. Please carry on championing our (my) cause.
You are a trustworthy, aware and informed advocate – the best kind.
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Hello again David. I am not one to dis this whole coronavirus pandemic but rewind two years ago when you and your team started out on the back to 60s campaign. At that time us women who had paid our NI contributions expected to get our pensions at 60. We were told that there was no money to pay us what we were due. Since then we have heard about the billions that have been ‘found’😞😞😞 to furlough millions of people billions that have been ‘allocated’ for this project and that project and still we women like me who had to leave work at 51 to look after my husband who has to be fed by me 3 times a day Etc etc etc due to him having to retire at the age of 48 due to suffering from chronic MS. Isn’t it funny how the government can find billions upon billions of pounds when they want to yet us women cannot access the pensions we paid into since we were 15 or 16 years old. Those judges who threw out our case have been highly rewarded by those in government with peerages etc. I hope they still feel the can hold their head up high. So so so angry. 😥😥😥😥😥 and depressed!!!!
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Curious you say the judges involved got peerages.I hadn’t noticed this. Can you point me to this
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Sorry David. I have nothing to substantiate my comment. But I think of another
who was looking after the plight of the elderly, and who all of a sudden became a Baronness and then changed her tune to be on the side of the government. I have never forgiven this women for her change of views. Still so angry!!! I know I have to be careful in my comments. 😥😥
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Sir Stephen John Irwin was made a Knight Batchelor in 2006, thus being made a ‘Sir’. In Oct 2016 he was appointed as a member of the Privy Council of the UK thus styled ‘The Right Honourable’.
Mrs Justice Whippke was made a Dame if the British Empire on 3/11/2015. Hope this is helpful.
Barbara
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Thank you David. Very interesting and informative.
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It was always so.
I don’t want to sound like I’m wingeing but I learned at a very early age as a woman I needed to work harder, be smarter, sharper, more enthusiastic and dedicated than any male work mate to succeed.
I earned less and was treated differently purely because I was a woman.
One instance of the difference – European cup I worked as usual, men in the office allowed to go home for the football or watch in the works canteen ! In effect the government have stolen my NI contributions so that they could pass them on to the 4.6 m men.
Time things changed. I will never give up and I’m not going away. You’ve poked the rattlesnake, I’m coming for you.
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Dear David Hencke,
I wrote an email to Pension Minister via my Tory MP about my getting those automatic NI credits granted, under equality.
I put for under age 60 as you stated men got them from 60 since 1983. I know pushing my luck somewhat.
Put in for auto credits from 2014 as ;
– 1954 born first pension age rise victim, turning 60 from 2014, so first full year pension age rise victims
– so missing a NI credit) if neither in work nor on benefit or the NI credits for child / grandchild / elder / disabled care.
Am retired (finally) but most women will never get the full new flat rate, due to SERPs being used to reduce the money, even if you have the 35 years NI record.
Even with 49 years NI history do not get the full new flat rate state pension.
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What a wonderful interview David – well done!
I listened to Jackie Jones on the BT60 livestream last night and I’m so glad to hear that you’re going to take this evidence to the appeal. I would love to see their faces when our legal team whip this out of the bag to confront them. The DWP lawyers won’t know how to answer it!
I’ve got 42 years NI and yet they still tell me I can’t get a full pension without paying for 5 more years!!! That doesn’t make sense when I was told 35 years are needed. I just don’t understand why???? David could you tell me why please?
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Paula, the short answer is I don’t know why this should be the case. I will try, time permitting, to investigate why.
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what l think is wrong and to be honest I don’t fully understand why when I have paid in for 47 years when the qualifying years are 35 to get the full state pension.I have checked recently and it states that I have to pay 2 extra years to get the full state pension. Surely you get the full pension when you have reached the 35 yrs mark. I have worked 47 years so the extra years mean nothing because I will get less state pension and not even the full rate this is so wrong I haven’t heard of any men getting paid less than the full state pension unless they qualified before 2016. Apologies if I am wrong but wish I was born a MAN and not a WOMAN. hope we win the appeal…..
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Janet. It may be that you employer contracted out of Serps for a period which may explain why you have only qualified for 33 years.
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Paula it’s because you were contracted out. I have 42 years but I was contracted out for 10 so I’m 3 short. It’s not a negative though because I will be getting more back through my OP and I still have the option to buy the 3 extra years. Quids in.
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Thank you so much Judi. I’m glad someone understands it.
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David first of all a big thank you for your reporting and everyone else that has made this appeal possible. I totally agree with Paula about paying for extra years when I already have 39 years full NI contributions and would have to pay more to increase my pension.
I and others will be very grateful if you do have time to investigate to find out why and once again thank you.
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Like you ANNE and many others I suspect. I have worked 47 years and paid in for all those 47 years and I have to pay an extra 2 years to get the full pension too. Its like a 4th Wammy.would love to know why we have to do this When Men got there’s covered from 60 yrs. 66 for women then you find out you have to pay in 2 more years to get the full pension. DISCRIMINATION INEQUALITY It most definately is…… thankyou David hope you can help us with this. many many thankyous.
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David why didn’t you mention men getting auto credits?
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Yes I listened to the interview and then read the article but am confused because you never mentioned autocredits in the interview.
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Yes it is auto credits – but I did describe the system whereby the state poays your national insurance contributions.
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Once again, many thanks for your diligence. Some time ago, a DWP worker told me that I had already more than amassed my credits as I had 38 years and only needed 35 (despite contracting out of SERPS). It now appears that I have to amass another 6 years. It is totally discriminatory for men to be able to claim back their contributions from 60 – what happened about our CEEDAW Rep?
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Thank you all so much 🙌
Sent from my iPhone
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But David I have worked 47 yrs surely that should make up for the 2 years extra that they are telling me to pay to get the full state pension feel like I’m getting robbed yet again worked 12 yrs longer than the 35 qulifying years anyway not only had 6 years added on they now want another 2 yrs of N.I.S contributions off of me. very cheesed off let down and very robbed is how I’m feeling right now. thankyou for everything you are doing for us and the advice it is very much appreciated.
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David if the court was to agree that notgiving women autocredits from 2010 was wrong and that the Government must give us autocredits from age 60 to 66 (my SPA), can you tell us how it could help us please? Or would it only be to age 65?
I currently have 43 NI years – born 54 so reach SPA in December of this year. I’ve checked my state pension forecast and I am only going to receive £134.25pw, nowhere near the full £175.20 that I should get. I’ve spoken to the DWP and they tell me that I can increase this to £154.23 if I pay for 4 years of NI which would cost me roughly £3120. I don’t really understand why it’s not 6 years but I was told it was because I have another pension.
So could I get autocredits for 5 or 6 years, pay nothing and get an extra £25 or £30pw? I was told each extra year would give me roughly £5pw.
I hope you can help to explain this David as you really seem to understand it well.
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Senga three points. Firstly seriously consider buying the extra state pension by paying the voluntary National Insurance Contributions. No doubt you will have worked out that after approximately 3 years you will be quids in. They are invariably a good deal for most people. You’ll live to see a return on your money and then for years afterwards I hope. Secondly the explanation of why you are not going to receive what you call “full” state pension is that you will have an entitlement to a company pension scheme that was contracted out of SERPS. Remember that? A better way of working out your true state pension figure is to dig out the most recent statement from the company scheme and look to see the value of what is called “Guaranteed Minimum Pension” or GMP for short. Add the GMP figure to the State Pension forecast figure to get a true picture. Contracting out meant that employers agreed to take responsibility for providing that additional part of your Retirement Pension. Auto credits will not help you now and I believe will not, despite what some people are saying, be raised at the Court of Appeal which will only consider points of law arising from the judgement of the High Court last June. I hope this helps.
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Peter thanks for your reply which does help a lot. So basically if I’m reading you correctly I’m not losing anything at all as I’m getting the additional pension with my works pension instead of with my state pension. After reading this I did a bit of searching and found this which helps a lot too.
https://www.royallondon.com/media/good-with-your-money-guides/the-new-state-pension-your-questions-answered/
Thanks also for telling me that if I did pay the extra NI I would be benefiting after 3 years – is that because the extra I get with my state pension every week adds up to what i paid within 3 years? That’s really good to know as no-one has explained that to me.
I’m very disappointed to hear that you don’t think this will be raised at the appeal. BT60 told me that it definitely would on Twitter and that it would mean we all get our earned dues back again as it’s a certain injustice to us as 4.6m men all got given money to retire at age 60.
David is this really true what Peter thinks?
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Good question. The position it is normally the case about new evidence as I understand. But given the equality issue between men and women is already covered in the case I imagine the lawyers will raise this. But I am not privy to how exactly they will handle the case.
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Thank you again David for all of your ongoing support for us 1950s women it is greatly appreciate !
So today’s news brings a promise from Boris Johnson, the government to provide a emergency cash fund of £1.57 bn pounds for the arts which is great. However this is yet yet again a kick in the teeth for us and a solemn reminder that this government leader cares more about the economy that the people in the country he gets paid to serve and of how he cruelly went back on his word to help sort out the grave injustice done to all us women who actually have to watch what little money we have to live on to be able to afford eat and pay our bills never mind afford the treat of being able to go to the theatre etc.. I hope and pray that we get more MPs with integrity supporting us, and that truth and Justice will prevail for us all very soon !
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But David I have worked 47 yrs surely that should make up for the 2 years extra that they are telling me to pay to get the full state pension feel like I’m getting robbed yet again worked 12 yrs longer than the 35 qulifying years anyway not only had 6 years added on they now want another 2 yrs of N.I.S contributions off of me. very cheesed off let down and very robbed is how I’m feeling right now. thankyou for everything you are doing for us and the advice it is very much appreciated.
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